"R U OK?" A Question That Could Save A Life.
72Foreword: I have an intense dislike for articles about depression that are simplistic, dismissive, judgemental, or presented by amateurs pretending to be experts, parroting formulaic ‘answers’ and ‘proven help programs’ for a problem that frequently defies all reason and rational analysis. Especially self-analysis.
The only articles I dislike more, are those written by the many bona fide experts whose professional reputations seem to have been earned at the expense of a willingness to acknowledge that endogenous depression (vs reactive depression) is really no better understood by many experts than by many lay people, is not 'easily managed' with pharmaceutical drugs, even when augmented by cognitive therapy; and is anything but a self-indulgence that can be readily overcome, if only sufferers would “keep taking their medication, and work harder at taking responsibility for their own mental wellbeing”. Experience the bottomless depths of depression yourself, Doctor, then tell me that again.
I’m not academically qualified in the area of mental health, but I do have personal experience of lifetime clinical depression (and resultant life-changing 'events'), plus the shame of being unable to prevent a parent from succumbing over many years to progressively more severe forms of institutionalising mental illness, and the suicide of a workplace contemporary; not close enough to call a friend, but more than close enough to have welcomed a call from; a call for help, had it ever come.
To be honest, had I received such a call, it would have taken me by surprise. I hadn't noticed anything amiss. Nor, apparently, had anyone else in our workplace. And that’s really the background to this article, which, you’ll be pleased to know, is going to be strictly on-topic, and to the point. These are simply my personal thoughts. I’ll leave it to you to decide whether they have merit.
.
The topic is suicide.
.
The point is prevention.
.
The process is communication.
.
Through question and answer
.
In Australia, the annual event called “R U OK? Day”, takes this simple premise and expands it into a day when people are encouraged to take a step towards taking responsibility for helping someone in difficulty, by asking the simple question, “Are you OK?” Not of someone who’s just fallen down, and as a result, is in physical difficulty. But someone who may appear only mildly troubled, if at all, and yet be on the edge of a much steeper decline, perhaps even at the edge of a precipice. Someone in mental difficulty, someone potentially contemplating suicide.
Contrary to popular belief, it’s my belief that people seriously contemplating suicide don’t ‘do it to get attention’, don’t ‘do it because they’re weak’, don’t ‘do it to punish someone else’.
Again stressing that I’m stating my own personal experience-based thoughts, I believe there comes a point when suicide often seems like the right / the logical / the strong / the honourable / the only thing to do.
And so, too often, it is done.
Leaving behind a legacy of shock, grief, regret, guilt, and the unanswerable question, “Why didn’t they talk to me / us / someone?”
But in reality, and the reason why “Are you OK?, should be top of mind every day, not just one day a year, the question should be, “Why didn’t I / we / someone talk to them?”
You won’t find many severely depressed people casually bringing it up in conversation, much less telegraphing any suicidal intention. In fact, there may be no signs at all for you to spot; beyond a feeling that something’s ‘not right’. But that‘s enough reason to ask "Are you OK?"
When you do;
Don’t take ‘yes’ for an answer.
In retail, sales staff are trained to not ask the closed question “Can I help you?”, which can be deflected by a simple “no thanks”; but instead to ask the open-ended, “How can I help you?”
That question has a far greater chance of opening a dialogue, and leading to a positive result.
That’s why, to me, the question “Are you OK?”, which is more likely to draw a politely dismissive “Yeah, I’m fine” from someone in real trouble, and for that reason not keen to open up, to discuss their difficulties, should be supplemented by another question, something like, “That’s good. How fine?”
That small showing of genuine concern and interest could be the trigger to opening a dialogue, and as the R U OK? campaign says, “a conversation that could change a life.”
Talking won’t solve everything, and may solve nothing.
That heading is for all the people who tried so hard, for so long, to find a way to “change a life”, change a direction, for a loved one or a friend. Yet were unable to do so. For trying, you have my deepest respect and admiration. For your loss, you have my deepest sympathy. In fact, because ‘talking won’t solve everything, and may solve nothing’, I hesitated to write this article at all, because expecting to prevent suicide by asking “Are you OK?” sounds every bit as simplistic as the ‘formulaic’ processes I began by criticising.
But clearly, there’s a path, a continuum, that can lead a depressed person to gradually lose perspective to the extent that the only way out is to take their own life.
So to me, it also follows that at any time, different people will be at different stages along that path. And perhaps there is a stage at which it’s not too late to hope that asking the simple question, “Are you OK?”, and not taking ‘yes’ for an answer, coupled with the genuine willingness to take the time to open a dialogue, and listen with your heart, might, just might, be “the conversation that changes a life.”
But if we don’t ask the question, we’ll never know.
.
©Copyright writeronline. All rights reserved.
vote upvote downshareprintflag
- Useful (8)
- Funny
- Awesome (1)
- Beautiful (1)
- Interesting (4)
CommentsLoading...
I agree with you, Bob. I think that in certain circumstances a decision to commit suicide is perfectly rational, and it's nobody else's business to say what those circumstances should be.
My only purpose in writing this piece, is to suggest that the involuntary feelings of disconnection and isolation that are a part of worsening depression, MAY be ameliorated by a sign of genuine interest and concern from someone else. And MAY therefore slow or stop a decline towards suicide becoming the default option.
Thanks for commenting.
Very good read, and thought provoking. I see where it could possible work, yet could not you just never know, but is it ever wrong to have compassion for someone and really ask if they are okay? You can't go wrong really showing compassion for another to let them know you are someone that cares. Oddly it could save someone's life from not taking there own life. I've seen it happen.
WOL, I think it is a very commendable initiative to raise awareness of people who never think about how close they are to those who are on the verge of a precipice and how little sometimes is necessary to prevent a lethal outcome.
I can fill a book just with my own story and the story of my family. To understand how it feels - to be suicidal - one has to be suicidal. I was. I was reaching out. I was not alone. I remember when a friend ("a friend") told me that I could call anytime and talk to her. The next day I did. She never picked up the phone.
Since that time, I don't really talk to anyone but my doctor. I am not that desperate, but even at home, when this suicidal wave comes, I might cry and my son would ask "Why are you crying?" I would just say "No reason."
Both positions are difficult - being depressed and trying to help a person with depression. Maybe "Are you OK?" would not help.
You have no idea how I hate this "How are you?" which means nothing. Sometimes (not too often) I would say "I'm constipated and if you don't care or don't want to hear an answer like that don't ever ask me again."
Well, I am not as bad as it sounds. I do care about others. I don't "buy" this "I'm fine", I am not blind.
And DO HATE people speculating about suicide as if they know. They know nothing.
P.S. I was hospitalized for being suicidal only once. Ironically enough, it was Sept. 14. The next day I pleaded them to let me out - I felt so much worse there. I swore I won't do anything. And I swore to myself never to go back - but it was hell. Anti-depressants start working only in six weeks minimum and there were another two weeks before I saw a new doctor. Two months... before I got any better.
The problem, I think, is that we don't know. Depression is a fact of life and everybody should know what to do if they see symptoms in themselves or others - like the "First Mental Aid". And remove this stigma from the word "mental". We are all mental - we all have brains. And there is no "insurance" that one day - that ones who have all the answers would not be faced with the questions.
Two members of my graduating class committed suicide the calender year of our ten year reunion. the one dealt with clinical depression. The other did not but had been dragged through the mud very publicly and his reputation ruined shortly before.
WO, this was beautiful. :D And, for those of us who have been at that place where ending it all seemed the most rational choice, I truly believe that "How are you?" or "Are you okay?" asked with sincere compassion often does make a difference - and sometimes THE difference.
Thanks for caring.
I remember visiting a long-time friend many years ago, after not having seen her in a while. Physically she looked awful, and I wanted to say something, at a minimum, ask if she was okay, but I didn't.
Several months later, she learned she had pancreatic cancer and passed away a few months after that. I always wonder what her outcome would have been had I asked her if she was okay when I visited her.
The experience made me determined to ask that simple question if I am ever in a similar situation, and your article has taught me how to keep the conversation going. Thanks for sharing, WOL.
I always ask people 'How are you?' and I genuinely want to know. To me it is important to do people the honour of actually listening to what they say.
Sadly though it is also true that the most seriously depressed people hide behind the reply 'I'm fine!' and it is impossible to shake them out of that statement, even though you know for certain they are not.
WOL, for personal reasons, I am unable to explain where I stand, but I now don't know if it looks as if I have trivialised this subject by my penultimate hub, or helped. Regardless, it was done with the best intentions.
Suffice to say the poem was written from a very personal perspective, and if someone would have asked that question of me, perhaps I would not have attempted what I did.
All I can say is that it was West Australia, and the policy then was, "The guy is insane, Send him to the Lunatic Asylum (we are talking about almost fifty years ago, when P.C, in Perth wasn't even known or understood).
Rant finished, Rated UP and USEFUL.
JannyC, hi, I agree with you. It's hard to see how showing compassion could ever be wrong. Thanks for commenting.
kallini, hi, thanks for reading, and thanks for your thoughtful comment. I agree with you, don't know why so many people persist in saying "How are you", when they have zero interest in hearing the answer.
That's what prompted me to write this article. The R U OK? campaign doesn't go beyond that question, which I think is a major flaw, and why I suggested "Don't take Yes for an answer". Just getting thousands more people to ask a question they really don't want an answer to, is pointless really, and potentially damaging, if you're someone who'd actually benefit from some genuine human contact, even if only on one day...you know what I mean, I'm sure.
On the other hand, I do think the campaign is a good initiative, because its main aim is to get depression and especially suicide talked about openly, and take away the negative connotations.
Hopefully though, that won't result in even more 'armchair experts' opining on, and simplifying something that is as you say, far too complex for that.
Hi FBR, a sad story to hear, but just as sadly, not an uncommon one. Hope you don't have too many more losses like that.
Hi MO, long time no hear! Thanks for reading, and thanks for your kind comment. You may be surprised (or you may not...) at just how well I can identify with your words "...for those of us who have been at that place where ending it all seemed the most rational choice.."
Happily, we're still here. (Well, I'm happy that you are.. :)
Cheers
Hi PW, don't be beating yourself up too much, we can't take responsibility for other people's lives, or the things that befall them. But I'm glad you think there's merit in my suggested approach to keep a conversation going. It's not easy though, because you don't want to pry, or force yourself on anyone. I guess it's really 'one situation at a time'.
Thanks for reading, PW, and for commenting.
Angie, hi.
"To me it is important to do people the honour of actually listening to what they say."
That's the whole thing, right there. But, as you say, to the truly depressed "I'm fine" is a wall of silence. It's certainly my standard response, and has been all my life.
Ranks right up there with keeping a smile on your face, and finding the funny side of life (more accurately, reflecting your perspective on life in ways that hopefully make other people laugh.)
Life would be so much easier, if it wasn't so complex, wouldn't it?
TL, thanks for reading this, and thanks for your positive ratings.
As with the poem to which you refer, this was also written from a personal perspective, (and I've probably given away more than I intended. A simple "I'm fine" should have sufficed...)
But to me, personal perspective is what makes stuff worth reading, so again referring to your poem, I don't think it trivialises anything, nor did that cross my mind. I think it's very powerful; although as you'll see fom my comment beneath it, I seem to have a somewhat different perspective from others on what it's saying..
Re your other comment above,(Perth circa 1963), "The guy is insane, send him to the Lunatic Asylum", these days Community Care (yeah, right..), has replaced the Lunatic Asylum, and the language has changed of course.
Now it'd be, "The guy's f**cking nuts, throw him in the slammer."
Onward we march to enlightened times...
I agree with you on this, and we should take the time to ask that question, genuinely and not just out of politeness. We should be willing to listen to the answer, and to notice if the answer is clearly not the truth - it's instinctive to say 'fine' when we're really not. I think that not-depressed people can find it difficult to show genuine concern for people suffering depression, because they find it awkward and embarrassing and don't know how to react - but I think they need to get over that, practice listening, and stop feeling as though they need to fix things. Often just listening is enough.
At the same time though, there are people I don't want to share my woes with, and if those people ask I will always say 'fine' and they will get nothing more out of me. I know their concern isn't genuine, and they're after a bit of gossip. I'm not going to spill my emotions for every person who asks.
And I think that sometimes I am that person who friends would prefer not to talk to about their depression - they know I have never suffered from real depression, and as such they find it difficult to talk to me about it because they think that I cannot relate. But I've seen depression, albeit once removed, I've seen more than one person in the depths of despair and contemplating suicide and genuinely not wanting to be alive any more. I know what that looks like from the outside, and I know how to be a listener. It's not always enough, but at least it's something.
Linda.
LW, hi,thanks for your thoughtful comment. What you say is of course, correct. Not everyone wants to talk; not everyone's motives for listening are honest. There is no standard operating procedure, just as there are no standard answers. But just asking the question, and meaning it, sends a message, even if no further dialogue develops. Conversely, as you say, listening, really listening, to someone, requires no special skills - beyond genuine interest, and compassion.
WOL, I have been thinking about it the whole day - I wonder what would be the outcome of the initiative? Will there be a report of stories or something? We can sit and speculate, but I wonder how they will evaluate the results?
Maybe you can let us know.
Hi kallini, this event is in its third year, so there are quite a few worthwhile things to read about on the website (linked above, beneath the Official R U OK? Policy panel), incl stories from past years, on this page
http://www.ruokday.com.au/content/stories.aspx
No doubt new stories will come to light and appear onsite soon.
Even though there's a focus on the one day event, the R U OK? concept obviously continues all the time, so I'll be leaving this hub up permanently. There's 364 more days in every year after all...
Hi WOL, it is so easy to miss at the time, what seemed obvious signs after the event. My wife works in the mental health field and my mother died in an institution. It doesn't make me an expert of course, just one of the many touched by it. We lead such busy lives that the obvious can often get overlooked. Blaming someone for committing suicide is a common occurrence, but i agree that at the time the person must feel that it is the right choice. We keep so much inside of us that it is difficult to ever really know what a person is thinking. Asking is better than doing nothing and your suggestion is a good one. Cheers.
Hi AH, thanks for reading, and thanks for commenting.
Sorry to read of your mother; mine was also in care when she died, but happily, at that particular time, not in an institution.
I say 'happily', also because, given the grey hair I see in your profile pic, you may be old enough to identify with me when I say that, given what passed for mental care during Mum's lifetime (enforced daily doses of stupefying tranquilisers - often conflicting with one another, shared adult dormitories, unilaterally programmed electric shock 'therapy', lack of family consultation from 'doctors', etc etc...), when Mum died, still only in her 60s, it was a blessed relief. For her and for us, her four adult chidren.
For the last fifteen years of her life, she was shunned by our wider family, who never asked, "Are You OK?", because they already knew the answer, and were all 'too busy' to care.
The same people reacted with shock and anger when my siblings and I gave Mum a funeral attended only by us, (and her..), and didn't make her death public until the day after. But we all agreed, the only thing worse than not caring about someone in your family, is pretending you did, after they've gone, by attending a funeral that's actually more about 'closure' for the living attendees, than genuine respect for the deceased.
We knew Mum felt the same way, and for us it was a way of helping her retain (actually, regain) her dignity.
Cheers.
A beautiful hub concerning an often hard to approach subject. A genuine, empathetic approach to 'are you OK?' and having it be a Real question, Not a greeting, and Waiting for a real answer, can not be wrong on the asking person's part. Great hub!
Hiya Bobbi, of all the people I appreciate commenting on this hub, I'm especially delighted to see your positive reaction, because I know you have a great deal of experience in the wider field of 'care providing'. As I said in the piece, I hesitated to write it, for the reasons I explained. So your 'professional endorsement' is very rewarding to me. Thankyou.
As I'm sure you noticed, there's a great deal of insight and open-ness and compassion contained in the comments it's drawn. Which of course increases its worth to anyone who reads the whole thing.
I think it's actionable information. Let's hope it makes a difference to somebody's life.
Hi WOL, ditto to everything. I can totally understand why you chose to act the way you did. I had exactly the same experience, or perhaps a little worse because I was the only person in my entire family not to feel ashamed of my mother. There were seven weddings involving my siblings and mine was the only one my mother attended. Modern medication would probably have cured the post natal depression that i suspect that my mother suffered from. She had shock treatment before i was born, so i suppose i am fortunate to be here. She gradually retreated from the pressures of life, into a safer world where she could cope. I used to kneel in front of her and coax her former self out, where she would demonstrate the intelligence and fine qualities that she still possessed. I stopped being ashamed of her when i was about thirteen, when a so called friend laughed in my face about my home life. A bolt of steel shot through me and i said "no more". From that day on i stopped crossing the street to avoid being seen with her and proudly walked with her for all to see. She was a lovely person, with too much on her plate in the early fifties. My dad had to work from 6 am until well after midnight six nights per week, driving coaches, leaving her to look after four boisterous children. You are not alone. Cheers
Hi AH. Respect.
Hi :)
Depression is a living nightmare. Anyone who has not been through it, finds it very hard to fathom.
I have suffered the 'bottomless depths' of the black abyss, but I was unable to guess that a friend would take his life, the day after welcoming me into his family home and making me a cup of tea. Could I have said or done anything to have changed what was about to happen? ~ I'm guessing not.
As for suicide, I remember discussing this with a psychiatrist friend. He said that, ironically, suicidal thoughts tend to arise, when the person is beginning to get better.
In the depths of depression, sufferers rarely care enough to consider ending it all. However, when the person starts to get better, s/he starts to realise how awful s/he feels, and that is when the 'I can't live like this' thoughts begin.
Perhaps knowing that these feelings are a symptom of getting better might help them to cope better.
Hi Trish, thanks for reading, and making your contribution to the many similarly insightful comments this hub has drawn. I do hope people read the comments, in my experience they frequently add a great deal to the content of hubs (my hubs, certainly...).
Thw whole thing to me about suicide is that it is very beguiling. I've contemplated it so much over my whole life that it's become like an old friend I can talk to when things get tough, (as of course, they invariably do, depression being something of a cyclical beast, even when you've learnt to live with it, to the point that medically speaking you probably are considered to be 'better'). It no longer holds any fears for me, and 'suicidal ideation' is more about practicalities (like methodology, time and place) than being suddenly emotionally overwhelmed and acting in that 'moment of madness'. I think (myself, my thoughts only) that 'acquired level of comfort' could explain situations like the one you described, where there are no signs at all of what a person may be planning; because they're not distressed by it.
As I said all through my article, I was reluctant to write it, but I didn't admit that was because I'm the very kind of person whose first and final response will always be "I'm fine", and about whom I know, others would say, post event, "What? Why? He was always such a happy guy, always had a smile and a kind word".
Nonetheless, I do stand by the final rationale for the piece: there MAY be a time when somebody is at a sufficiently early stage of the disease (that's what it is), that a genuinely meant "Are you OK?" MAY make the difference.
It's got to be worth asking, doesn't it?
Yes, I am reminded of a letter that I once read in a magazine, where a lady said that she had kept meaning to get in touch with a bereaved and lonely relative, but wasn't sure exactly what to say, and just never got around to it. Then she heard that this relative had committed suicide. She felt that, maybe, if the lady in question had felt less alone, and that somebody cared, she may not have done it.
I have had conversations with others, who were then contemplating suicide, and who, with a little support, managed to come through it, and see better times on the other side.
When I was suffering post-natal depression, it wasn't diagnosed until I read my symptoms ~ in another magazine. I told my health visitor and she apologised for missing the signs, but said that depressed people have the ability, or desire, or whatever, to cover it up.
I think that it is easier to appear bright and cheerful, when interacting with others. The black abyss cannot be pushed aside so easily when one is alone.
My consultant said that my optimism, in spite of my being depressed, probably saved me ~ and possibly my baby, too ~ during the worst of my depression. I think it may have been that, together with the depression apathy my friend had described.
When I was at my lowest ebb I couldn't see any point in suicide, because I thought that I was dead already. When I started to get better, and experienced the 'I can't live with this' thoughts, I also decided that it was probably temporary and that I wasn't going to end it at a horrible time; I was going to get through it, so that I could enjoy the good times ahead.
I still get 'that feeling' at times, but, basically, I am very happy and contented ~ and optimistic. :) I suppose that I am just really lucky :)
@Trish, yes indeed depression is a living NIGHTMARE. I never understood why, and how people would be depressed for no reason, until it happen to me. I was depressed for years and didnt know it. How a person can be depressed and not know is beyond me, but I was. It is a battle among battles. I also totally agree with @writeronline just because someone say they R okay does not mean its true. I have said I was ok many, many times, and I was dying inside, and seriously thought about committing suicide. Your hub was very interesting, and glad I came across it.
Too many people ignore the signs and choose not to help when they do see them. Maybe a simple question like "Are you okay?" would not help...but maybe it would. For some people maybe they just need to see that someone cares enough to ask the question.
Voted up and useful.
Very helpful, informative hub with easy to incorporate encouraging skils; caring enough to care and ask a life saving question or two.
Suicide often runs in families. I suspect it is because the family is disfunctional, but I don't know this for sure. I do know that when life seems hopeless and helpless suicide becomes an appealing solution.
Hi LuxmiH, thanks for commenting, I'm glad you found it practical. As to suicide running in families, I don't know...
I do know that many years ago, when I was at a point when a senior work colleague did ask me "Are you OK?" and refused to take Yes for an answer, that person invited me a few days later, to lunch at his home, which was only a few streets away from the office.
When I got there I was introduced to three of his friends. Two of these guys were Ministers of religion, (not Mormons, or cult or fringe types, just 'regular' church guys). We just sat and ate and talked about nothing in particular, but once the meal was over, they gave me an 'unsolicited diagnosis' and religious top-up. Free of charge. Didn't even hint at a donation, or pass a plate, or anything... lol.
According to these guys, it was 'obvious on meeting me that I was struggling with a major mental / emotional block.' (Or, did my work associate give them a heads-up...?. Call me cynical..)
They'd also been able to determine that I was considering suicide (true), but that this had nothing to do with my depressed state of mind - rather it was because I was 'bearing a curse'. (I'm not making this up.) Their solution to enable me to banish and resist any and all suicidal thoughts was to tell me that I was merely the current generation's bearer of the curse, 'which has been in your lineage for hundreds of years', and that it was my responsibility to man up and 'resist it's evil influence in order to 1: make it to heaven, and 2: prevent the curse from traversing the generations and affecting my son/s, one of whom would be afflicted as surely as night follows day, when the curse jumps into the weakness created by their grief', if I were to check myself out.
Since I don't believe in God, (although I am open-minded about greater powers / greater things than we understand) I didn't, and still don't, believe any of it. But, it was an interesting 'frightener' because it created (then and on a few subsequent occasions) that little sense of doubt about whether topping myself at that point when it seems 'the right and hourable thing to do' would be as appropriate from other people's perspective. Especially the ones in my family.
It's been nearly twenty years since that lunch. And I'm still here....
Hi Writeronline :)
I'm very glad that this rather unorthodox meeting had a helpful effect :)
I do think that, for anyone who has depressive tendencies, it really is worth knowing that suicidal thoughts often arise when one's mental health is actually improving.
And, yes, for family, a suicide is particularly awful, I think. I have just recently been told of one, which is causing untold grief to some friends ~ and it is not the first amongst family friends.
I don't think that this subject is given enough consideration in society, generally, so depressed people, and their loved-ones, feel very confused, lost, alone, etc, and just do not know what to do, or where to turn.
Just knowing that there are people out there, who do understand, and who have got through it, must be beneficial, I think.
Hi Trish, thanks for your kind thoughts..and your insightful observation.
I'm delighted at how many people have added so much to this hub, in exactly the area that concerns you. People who've been 'at the edge of the precipice'(and some who've continued to step up to the edge since), have been willing to tell their stories here. And hopefully, as you say, by being open, sharing those situations and feelings, and yet still being here (alive), MAY possibly provide some help / perspective / balance to anyone reading this article, perhaps initially wondering,"Is it OK to say I'm NOT OK?" And as a result of what people have shared here, decide not only that it is, but to speak up first, act later, perhaps never...
It's a very broad subject, it's very complex, it's very frightening. But to me, all of those aspects can only gain by bringing suicide and depression out of the whispered half-light and into the open.
Suicide is unique to humans, perhaps that's why we're also the only species with the power of speech. The power to convey concern, love, empathy.
But to repeat my earlier conclusion "If we don't ask the question, we'll never know."
We spend millions on road safety campaigns, anti-drug / alcohol campaigns, save the animals campaigns, save the environment campaigns. And bugger-all on saving the mentally ill, because we're crippled by convention that says it's 'not something we should talk about, let's not encourage people, give them ideas'.
That's working well isn't it? How many more people have to be ostracised for 'catching the wrong disease' before we use those human powers of communication to fund decent programs to simply reach out and help?
Sorry Trish, it just gets me upset sometimes...
Thanks for coming back to this hub.
Hi again :)
There was an event on, in Solihull, recently, where they were trying to draw positive attention to this issue.
I was given a bag ~ and a cup with the following wording on one side:
'It's time to talk. It's time to change.
Let's end mental health discrimination.'
And on the other side:
'How u feeling?'
Trish, that's great to hear. There's certainly a lot more openness and acceptance these days than even twenty or thirty years ago. But still a long way to go. Initiatives like the one you mention, and the R U OK? topic of this hub, can only help.
writeronline: I remember as a child that one day my mother received a phone call from our minister. I was watching TV but I noticed my mother's quietness as she listened from her end. To this day I remember the way she slowly set down the phone at the end of the call. I was sensitive to sadness from an early age because my father passed away when I was 10, and it was difficult for my mother raising four children on her own with very little help from anyone, and then there was this minister who talked to her a lot about himself.
I asked her if something was wrong. What could be the sad news? I had already struggled with the sad news of losing my father.
My mother spoke calmly but I could see the sadness in her eyes. She told me that Father C had called to tell her that one of the parishioners had committed suicide. I think that she was in her sixties. Her husband was disabled, and although they lived in a nice house, they weren't among the most affluent in the church. She had been telling Father C for some time that she was overwhelmed by the situation of being solely responsible for her husband, that she needed help. I think that sometimes Father C, in his frequent monologues with my mother, had mentioned, as a complaint, to my mother about this woman's pleas for help. We were on a very tight budget; I know that my mother wanted to help but couldn't, so she tried to get Father C to understand that these pleas should not be ignored.
Father C's flippant comment always was that God never gives us anything that we can't handle.
Apparently when he called to tell my mother that this woman had committed suicide through carbon monoxide in the garage with the car running, Father C once again made that callous remark that God never gives us anything we can't handle.
The wife of one of my friend's committed suicide, and he told me that she had been seriously depressed and then suddenly seemed so much better. What he realized afterwards was that committing suicide had given her a purpose and that's why her mood improved.
I appreciate your covering this topic in such a concerned way. Prescribing medication doesn't always solve the underlying causes. There are valid reasons for feeling depressed in this world. Pills don't change that. And some of the side effects for anti-depressants actually induce thoughts of suicide.
Hi stessily, thanks for taking time to add your personal story to those that have appeared beneath my short, but heartfelt hub. No doubt you browsed those others as well, and would have been pleased to notice the absence of the flippant remark, (so typified by the comments of your Father C, whose God presumably thought he possessed more humanity than was apparently the case).
Perhaps though, the lack of pat, "it's all in your mind" comments really reflects the fact that depression still remains an area that many simply choose to regard as an 'elective ailment'.
Many people who've never experienced depression are fond of dismissing it with the glib, "It's your choice to be happy or sad. I choose to be happy." In spite of myself, and in spite of not wishing the black dog of depression on anyone, I do admit to sometimes hoping that at least a little rain would fall on these people's sunny lives, if only to wash away some of the smugness.
As to side -effects of medications, you're absolutely right. It's a recognised reality, and is stated as such on the product information leaflets supplied with pharmaceutical anti-depressants. Tricky stuff for a person only contemplating using drugs because they're struggling with their thoughts and emotions, to be required to consider the risks, and make an 'informed choice.' Either way, pills alone, as you say, are not the solution.
writeronline: I know those thoughts about hoping for rain to wash away the smugness of some people's perpetually sunny lives!
I really admire your sensitive presentation of depression. There are times, including now, when I look for goodness and fulfillment yet the reality of depressing situations and difficult people cannot be ignored or whitewashed. I have known people who've been prescribed pills which turn them into zombies; because the medication is somehow suppressing the true causes in daily life of their depression, they actually have exaggerated reactions to other situations because of the unresolved frustration from being desensitized to the situations which provoke their depression. I'm just speaking from observation of people I've known and from what others tell me. I'm not denigrating psychiatry or psychology but I feel that prescribing pills in a clinical setting is a solution which is being made in an environment which is estranged from the actual life situations which underlie the depression.
I am impressed with the sensitive, supportive comments which have been left here. For example, I would expect no less from Trish, whose compassionate intelligence I admire.
Anyone with any inkling of kindness in their hearts who reads this hub will appreciate your sensitive, nonjudgmental approach. Thanks again!
Hi again :)
Yes, I agree about problems caused by taking pills. I have seen people, whose health has been made worse, rather than better, because of prescription medicine.
I also think that doctors should bear some things in mind: clinical depression seems, usually, to occur without rhyme or reason BUT some sensitive people become 'depressed' as a result of a certain situation. Take away, or improve, that situation and the 'depression' may ease or disappear.
No amount of medication can change a bad situation; it just numbs the person to it ~ and, sadly, to everything else as well. In such circumstances, good counselling can be more beneficial than drugs.
Doctors need to be able to differentiate between the black abyss that is depression and the miserable mire which may be a sad or horrible situation.
I'd already read your profound poem about depression when it was first posted, and it moved me intensely. I re-read it today because suicide recently came much too close to devastating my family again.
Suicide reared its ugly head more than once among people I loved. The other occasions were completely unexpected. This time was not a surprise, so the result sought was circumvented. Help is available (and wanted), so maybe this was a one-time attempt. I fervently hope it will not happen again.
These experiences taught me not to take people at face value, so the question, "Are you okay?" is not my starting point. My object is to get someone talking by using open-ended questions and listen wholeheartedly to what he or she needs to say.
Sometimes simply verbalizing painful emotions to another person who cares is enough to bring relief--at least, for that moment in time. I always want to be ready to listen to anyone-family, friend, even a stranger--who needs to talk in order to find respite from emotional pain.
This is an excellent hub about a topic too often avoided. I'm so glad you wrote it, writeronline. Voted UP, USEFUL and AWESOME.
Thanks Jaye (You're all over my stuff today aren't you? I'm delighted at that.)Thanks for seing some value in this article. I can't for the life of me (bad pun?, - nah, it's OK, (not another one!) understand the way society still seems to be of the belief that suicide will somehow get worse if we start talking about it. It's way too prevalent already, so if talking (and of course, as you say, actually listening) makes a difference, even for just some people at risk, I'm all for it.
A very interesting article. (Coming from you that's not unusual!) It has set me thinking, something that I rarely do!
Cheers, and cheers to everybody.
quicksand, hi, I'm glad this has set you thinking. Thanks for taking the time to say so. Thanks for the compliment too, much appreciated!
diogenes Level 7 Commenter 8 months ago
If you've had enough of this "Valle de lagrimas," then you may give up your own life, quietly, with dignity and keeping it to yourself.
I am 72, and should I get a terminal disease, I like to think I would have the courage to end my life instead of facing weeks, months or years being kept alive in pain with no future. Apart from that, you have as much chance of my becoming suicidal as winning tonight's European jackpot lottery. Bob